Author Topic: Requesting help.  (Read 48376 times)

Offline Gene

  • Expert
  • Participant
  • ***
  • Posts: 1757
  • Likes: 190
Re: Requesting help.
« Reply #90 on: February 10, 2020, 07:20:22 AM »
If you want to make real Colloidal Silver and know what PPM you made, you NEED a current limiter. 27V and a resistor is not going to do it.  Without constant current (which you won't get), you have no clue what you made.

Read the articles and follow what they say.  These are time tested, true procedures for doing it properly. There is no "cutting any corner" here.

Also too, the current you need to use is rather small.  For silver wire, 5-10ma tops. For a silver bullion bar, 15-20ma and as I said, it must be constant current. This is the only way Faraday's law of electrolysis works. There is no other way to determine the PPM of your result.  There is no meter you can buy to measure it. Constant current and proper cell voltage and time based on Faraday's law of electrolysis is the only way to do it properly.

All reducers require you heat the IS solution to maybe 120F+ degrees. They reduce extremely slowly if even at all at room temp.  Even at 120F they can take a while.

The purpose of the sodium carbonate is to reduce the resistance of the water so you can get reasonably good current through the cell. It has a couple other purposes. Your cell is an electroplating cell. Without the sodium carbonate electrolyte, the silver ions you draw off the anode into the water would immediately plate-out on the cathode. This would render IS production worthless as you wouldn't make any. The electrolyte interferes with the silver plating out on the cathode where now you can build up the PPM in solution so when you reduce you actually get a reasonable PPM. The sodium carbonate also raises the PH of the solution to around 8-8.5PH (alkaline).  Reducers are sugars (glucose, maltodextrin,...) and they only work and reduce in an alkaline environment.

You really need to reread the articles and study them and BELIEVE what they say. If you don't follow the procedure properly, there's no clue what you made and no way to measure it.

Offline Turbidaceous

  • Participant
  • **
  • Posts: 472
  • Likes: 6
  • Living in the UK
Re: Requesting help.
« Reply #91 on: February 10, 2020, 02:50:16 PM »
I have just ordered a 30v 500mAh mains power supply, a 1M ohm Potentiometer and a pair of crocodile clips. I am going to try to rig up a constant current.

Offline Turbidaceous

  • Participant
  • **
  • Posts: 472
  • Likes: 6
  • Living in the UK
Re: Requesting help.
« Reply #92 on: February 10, 2020, 06:37:51 PM »
I think the one thing which still fully escapes me, is I have seen people here say adding some things to their Colloidal Silver (salt?) makes it go clear and back to ionic. Does that mean you can make the best actual colloidal silver, but when you take it, your body or the things in your stomach convert it back away from beiung colloidal into being ionic?

Offline cfnisbet

  • Administrator
  • Participant
  • *****
  • Posts: 2558
  • Likes: 184
Re: Requesting help.
« Reply #93 on: February 10, 2020, 09:02:05 PM »
No, that's why we use capping agents. These prevent, wholly or partially, the Colloidal Silver particles from being turned back into ionic silver. Cinnamon tincture seems to be adequate, gelatin seems to be excellent. That's why we recommend them.

Offline Turbidaceous

  • Participant
  • **
  • Posts: 472
  • Likes: 6
  • Living in the UK
Re: Requesting help.
« Reply #94 on: February 11, 2020, 02:34:28 AM »
Interesting. At first when I saw mentioning of capping, I thought people were talking about putting colloidal silver in capsules, because any time I ever heard capping that is what was meant. Is the "capping" agent needed due to the production method of the colloidal silver? Or is it a necesarry step for any and all colloidal silver made via any method at all?

Edit: I saw on one of the articles talking about adding 0.5ml of cinnamon tincture to the water during creation. If you make higher ppm do you have to add more than 0.5ml of cinnamon, such as 40ppm needing 1ml? It was not very clear to me if a 0.5ml of it should be used for a certain amount of water in the batch either.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2020, 02:55:39 AM by Turbidaceous »

Offline Turbidaceous

  • Participant
  • **
  • Posts: 472
  • Likes: 6
  • Living in the UK
Re: Requesting help.
« Reply #95 on: February 12, 2020, 05:54:03 PM »
I had a feeling the 1mega ohm potentiometer would be too strong. It was not granular enough, it went from no resistance when I tested it on my multimeter to like 20,000 ohm with the faintest whiff of movement on the dial. So I have ordered 100k ohm ones. I got my £11 30v 500mAh power supply. I stripped the wires, attached to crocodile leads and in trhe interrim until I get the new potentiometers I connected my existing 10k ohm in-line lead from my existing kit. I get a constant 2.77ma current. I am almost done making a 1.5L batch and then I shall filter and reduce it. This will be my first batch using non-battery power, constant current source.

Offline Turbidaceous

  • Participant
  • **
  • Posts: 472
  • Likes: 6
  • Living in the UK
Re: Requesting help.
« Reply #96 on: February 12, 2020, 06:55:22 PM »
Okay. I added 4 drops of dilute golden syrup. Less than I had been using initially with my first colloidal silver attempts. This batch using 2.77 constant current, is slightly lighter in colour (consistent with an example image I have seen on here with an A and B about how much reducer to add) but it is not quite as crystal clear as ones I have made. Yes, it is clear and I can see through it perfectly but it has a faint but present haze which only one of my other batches had. I am not sure what causes the tiny bit of haze but it looks like images I have seen on here of good reduced colloidal silver. So I am very satisfied.

One of my first batches on the left, latest one with the constant current above (I used the formula in Excel to calculate the right time to make it.


EDIT

What is a good but easy to achieve way of securing a 1 gram bullion bar for use in making colloidal silver so that stirers or fans won't blow the electrodes about and accidentally make them contact each other directly?

EDIT

By the way, my 30v 500mAh wall-wart power supply is working out great. I have connected a 100k Potentiometer (I shall switch it out in time for a 50k to have better sensitivity) and I have been able to dial in 4ma current in the water with my multi-meter in line. Then once satisfied I remove the multimeter and connect the leads together instead (just to remove the meter from the circuit) and I have successfully made a test 250ml batch in 18.8 minutes and then I microwaved it in a clean and dry coffee mug for about 2:30 with 1 drop of dilute golden syrup and some stiring. What a nice thing. It's a bit of work to set everything up but this simple system seems to be working great. In time I plan on buying a magnetic stirrer and setting up a classic 2 electrode in a top-down system as most people use. But for now, this is working great for me.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2020, 08:02:07 PM by Turbidaceous »

Offline Turbidaceous

  • Participant
  • **
  • Posts: 472
  • Likes: 6
  • Living in the UK
Re: Requesting help.
« Reply #97 on: February 18, 2020, 02:09:51 PM »
Turns out this is not constant current. I thought a mains powered power supply was constant current, compared to batteries which drain. I was wrong. I am ready to give up on constant current because I cannot find ANYWHERE the right clear, simple instructions on what you need to buy, how you use it and why it works. I hear about LM something or other and 2 transistor setups. It just confounds my brain and I do not understand any of it. I get potentiometers to drop the ma to the 3ma I want. I would really appreciate some information so that I can progress with my setup to make it perfect because I am close to giving up on it 😫

Offline Turbidaceous

  • Participant
  • **
  • Posts: 472
  • Likes: 6
  • Living in the UK
Re: Requesting help.
« Reply #98 on: February 22, 2020, 03:48:52 PM »
Regarding smoke. I can often detect wisps coming out when I shine a light through it at the right angle. But with just my eye without the light I see nothing. Does that classify as bad smoke? Even if you have to use a light to see it?

I made a batch earlier and it was perfect, even with a light I could not see any trace of anything. I fire cleaned the silver, did the same thing and this time I saw a bit of whispy strands of thin smoke coming out when I shine a flashlight on it. Now, I use a USB desk fan to blow on the water to create a bit of movement (until I can afford to buy this, which I have in my cart: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/79-1-1000ml-Hot-Plate-Magnetic-Stirrer-Lab-Heating-Dual-Control-Mixer-220V/143327380133  )so is the fan angle possibly the culprit of why last batch was the first perfect ever but this time I am seeing the usual thin strands coming off the silver?

Offline cfnisbet

  • Administrator
  • Participant
  • *****
  • Posts: 2558
  • Likes: 184
Re: Requesting help.
« Reply #99 on: February 25, 2020, 07:17:17 PM »
What you can see as "smoke" is often tiny bubbles, or silver oxide in the process of dissolving. If the end result is clear and not turbid, then it's fine.

Offline Turbidaceous

  • Participant
  • **
  • Posts: 472
  • Likes: 6
  • Living in the UK
Re: Requesting help.
« Reply #100 on: February 25, 2020, 07:29:13 PM »
It is usually fine. I only had issues without using the fan and using higher current. I saw the cathode geometry post and calculated my rough area and I should stick to 3ma (as I do now). But with a 1oz I should be able to do 10ma accommodating for how much I leave as a safety margin to connect the crocodile lead. But I may experiment with the 10g bullion coupling idea next time. I just have to borrow a drill because I do not own one myself. I have a junior hacksaw, so I would have to be very careful to clean the silver before using it as an anode... but I think it should work well based on your info about heating it. I will give it a quick diamond filing though to remove the fingerprint and any traces of things on the surface before I use it again though.

Offline Patnuck

  • Participant
  • **
  • Posts: 7
  • Likes: 0
Re: Requesting help.
« Reply #101 on: March 08, 2020, 01:01:55 AM »
I think I have a problem with my process.  I am using 27 volt battery power with home made constant current setup, using 2 transistors and resistors, with 999.99 Canadian Maple Coin and 12 gauge copper wire as the electrodes. I use a magnetic stirrer and run at 15ma with sodium carbonate electrolyte. After production I reduce with dilute corn syrup and the finished product looks perfect, nice straw color and clear as a bell. The problem I refer to is that if I shine a laser beam through I see the Tyndall effect although it is very sharp and defined. Is this normal or am I doing something wrong?  Thanks

Offline Turbidaceous

  • Participant
  • **
  • Posts: 472
  • Likes: 6
  • Living in the UK
Re: Requesting help.
« Reply #102 on: March 08, 2020, 01:41:09 AM »
Does it spread out and light up the whole jar? If so, that is bad. The more I make it, the better I get. My last four 1L batches have turned out perfect. Crystal clear, perfect yellow colour, no turbidity, no opalescence or "sheen" in the light and the Tyndall effect is quite faint and contained to the beam with no big sparkles or anything just a very faint haze beam. Even with a laser. I'd call that perfect. So if your Tyndall is faint and constrained only to the light source's natural beam, it is probably ok. But if it lights up like a christmas tree or a searchlight through the fog, then it's bad.
« Last Edit: March 08, 2020, 09:42:55 AM by Turbidaceous »

Offline Patnuck

  • Participant
  • **
  • Posts: 7
  • Likes: 0
Re: Requesting help.
« Reply #103 on: March 08, 2020, 02:22:28 AM »
Thanks for the reply, no it does not light up like a Christmas tree it seems to be contained within the beam. I might add that the laser is from a a temperature reader and is quit strong. I have another laser pointer than is not as strong and doesn't show up at all when shone through. From your answer I think I'm concerned unnecessarily, thanks.

PhiPhi

  • Guest
Re: Requesting help.
« Reply #104 on: March 19, 2020, 12:57:58 PM »
I just finished my first 250ml batch,

Electrolyte: 5 drops of Sodium carbonate (anhydrous) I mixed 1 level tea spoon to 60ml (2.11 Oz) DW
Anode: 1 Ozt Silver Maple 80% submerged
Cathode: Thin copper wire approx 1mm diameter submerged 5mm
Electrodes: spacing 38mm (1.5 inches)
Power: 3 PP9 27v Batteries with potentiometer inline from + to anode
Medium: 250ml Medical grade DW
Reducer: 5 drops Karo diluted 1:1 DW

The first 5 mins were a bit of a learning curve trying to get the voltage down from 16v-14.6v to around 13.5 volts
Then 15 minutes at a steady 13.4 volts but the current was around 21ma (but not sure if I was using the multimeter correctly)
The coin blackened somewhat and the anode fizzed with tiny bubbles, I saw no 'smoke' coming off the coin.
Added reducer and 900 watt microwaved for 60 sec, stirred and repeated 30 sec 3 times, throughout this stage the solution went from clear to yellow.

I can see the Tyndall effect strongly with the lights out and a few sparklers, in low light it's feint and in bright light non existent, the laser source is a laser measure with a strong thick beam.  Anyone care to speculate if I can use this even just as mouth wash or disinfectant?