Author Topic: whats my mistake?  (Read 862 times)

Offline imcool

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whats my mistake?
« on: May 30, 2021, 06:01:20 PM »
hello,
I tried to make 320ppm and this is the result at 11mA for 7.5 hours. Can you explain what caused this?
this is exactly what i did

before starting cell I did this

1. 1 liter double distilled water heated at 70 C continuous stirring
2. Added diluted 1:1 karo 20drops
3. Added 1ml of sodium carbonate 1M solution.
4. Added 40 drops gelatin solution ( gelatin solution made from cfnisbet tip)

Then Started electrolysis cell 12-15v at 11mA for 7.5hours continuous stirring and continuous cleaning

This is the result, there is so much left over of black matter(which didnt dissolve in silver) after filtering which never happened with me before,

Can someone explain to me what mistake I made here as after filtering its not 320ppm anymore, its has become less ppm? Please check pictures





Offline Gene

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Re: whats my mistake?
« Reply #1 on: May 30, 2021, 08:16:24 PM »
The current wisdom as to how much 1:1 diluted karo is necessary is as follows:

Karo (1:1 in vodka - drops):
   PPM * ml / 2000

320 * 1000 / 2000 = 160 drops

Under the assumption that 20 drops is 1ml (damn close), you'd need 8ml of diluted karo.

So, you only shorted the karo by 140 DROPS!  Oops.

It used to be a divisor of 16000 but there was a discussion a few months back and Kephra was involved and his recommendation was to lower the divisor to 2000.

So, with so little reducer, I'm sure there's a LOT of dissolved silver oxide and all that gunk is probably precipitated silver oxide.  Sad to see you wasted that much silver but its all a learning experience.

Also, regarding gelatine for gel capping, the formula to calculate the correct amount (dry) is

Gelatine (mg):
   PPM * ml / [160...80 ]

So in your case, we're talking 2000mg-4000mg (2-4 GRAMS)

I don't know how much gelatine is in 40 drops of solution, sorry


« Last Edit: May 30, 2021, 08:29:20 PM by Gene »

Offline imcool

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Re: whats my mistake?
« Reply #2 on: May 30, 2021, 09:07:42 PM »
Gene thanks so much for replying,
i saw two different things on forum for gelatin, if you can clear that up for me please

1st says following:



2ond says following:



Question 1 - Can you tell me which gelatin way  should I go with for 320ppm continuous heat method.
 A. make gelatin solution as per cfnisbet reply or B. add 1gram as per other reply (please check images)

Question 2 - Add karo syrup before starting the electrolysis and add gelatin solution after electrolysis is done, is this correct?

Offline Gene

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Re: whats my mistake?
« Reply #3 on: May 30, 2021, 09:21:42 PM »
That gelatine formula came from something Kephra posted a ways back.  So perhaps he should chime in on this one. I've never made 320PPM. Never saw the need. I usually make 120PPM which is concentrated enough. A gallon of that is equivalent to 6 gallons of 20PPM.

There's also debate on whether or not adding the gelatine before the run or after is important.  I've never gotten a straight answer on this one.  I add it after a run for 120PPM and get great results.  I can't say what 320PPM requires.

I did read something more recently that adding the gelatine before the run, though it does slow down reduction speed, creates smaller silver particles, closer to 10nm in size so I guess thats a good thing.

As I recall, the "old" "best" reducer for 320PPM used to be cinnamon tincture but some guys don't like it because it imparts a flavor of cinnamon to the Colloidal Silver.

No, there are no black and white answers - just good ones and bad ones - just like life in general. You have to find what works best for you and keep doing it (wink).

Perhaps Kephra can chime in on the amount of gelatine and whether or not it NEEDS to be added before the run for making 320PPM.

Offline kephra

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Re: whats my mistake?
« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2021, 07:38:48 PM »
4 grams of gelatin per liter of water.  Gelatin should be added to the water, allowed to bloom, then heated to simmer to dissolve gelatin before electrolysis is started.
There is the unknown and the unknowable.  It's a wise man who knows the difference.

Offline imcool

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Re: whats my mistake?
« Reply #5 on: June 08, 2021, 02:22:46 AM »
4 grams of gelatin per liter of water.  Gelatin should be added to the water, allowed to bloom, then heated to simmer to dissolve gelatin before electrolysis is started.
hello Kephra, I did add 4grams before i did this batch above and i failed 4 times because the water was turning snowy.
please check this thread.

https://www.cgcsforum.org/index.php?topic=5585.0

REgards

indocomp

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Re: whats my mistake?
« Reply #6 on: August 25, 2021, 10:00:27 AM »
Hi i am a little bit confuse

4 gram of gelatine
1,7 ml of karo diluted 50/50 based on calculator ( probably x 3 better )
and 1ml of electrolyte
for 1 litre 320 ppm, does it has to be in order?
for example heated the gelatine first to simmer , after that add the karo and the electrolte and start the process
or
Just add all together heat it and start the process?

Offline kephra

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Re: whats my mistake?
« Reply #7 on: August 25, 2021, 10:27:04 AM »
Add all the ingredients, order does not matter, then heat, then electrolysis.
There is the unknown and the unknowable.  It's a wise man who knows the difference.

indocomp

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Re: whats my mistake?
« Reply #8 on: August 25, 2021, 11:55:18 AM »
Ok, thank you for your confirmation
Can i heat it using microwave to get 75 degree? and keep the heat with electric stove without stirring like Gene did?
No stirring part because i need to choose between small electric stove and magnetic stirring since i dont have both in a single device

thanks

Offline imcool

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Re: whats my mistake?
« Reply #9 on: March 30, 2022, 11:09:33 PM »
4 grams of gelatin per liter of water.  Gelatin should be added to the water, allowed to bloom, then heated to simmer to dissolve gelatin before electrolysis is started.

thanks for this tip, it works like a charm,all good, i made another batch, 11milliamps @ 8 hours.