Author Topic: First Colloidal Silver run today  (Read 11114 times)

SanchoPanza

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Re: First run today
« Reply #15 on: June 26, 2015, 10:40:50 PM »
The bubbles are on the anode bi time, as pictured.
There were also some on the cath, but using so little, it's hard to see.

Rick, spot-on, the IS has a yellow tinge.
Do my electrodes look normal after this run?

-Sancho

Offline kephra

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Re: First run today
« Reply #16 on: June 26, 2015, 10:47:39 PM »
Yes, that looks normal.  Bubbles are normal also.
There is the unknown and the unknowable.  It's a wise man who knows the difference.

SanchoPanza

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Re: First run today
« Reply #17 on: June 27, 2015, 02:23:27 AM »
Yahoo! First batch!

Left side samples were reduced warm, with 5 drops cinnamon.
It looked weak, so I added 1 extra drop to the far left. It got slightly darker.

Right side is reduced warm, with 1 drop agave syrup.
Near right has 1 extra drop agave, slightly darker.

How'd I do?

-Sancho

SanchoPanza

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Re: First run today
« Reply #18 on: June 27, 2015, 02:26:08 AM »
The 2 cinnamon on the left side is clearer that the 2 agave reduced, on the right.

-Sancho

Offline kephra

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Re: First run today
« Reply #19 on: June 27, 2015, 02:41:26 AM »
You did well.  I would forget agave though, just because you don't know whats in it.  For 20 ppm, ordinary Karo corn syrup is as good as anything, and we know exactly whats in it.

Or you can make a 50/50 saturated solution of glucose and fructose to do the same thing.

There is the unknown and the unknowable.  It's a wise man who knows the difference.

SanchoPanza

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Re: First run today
« Reply #20 on: June 27, 2015, 03:43:07 AM »
Thanks Kephra, I owe part of my success to you and the group.
The agave syrup is 100% extract, nothing added. How it's extracted I do not know.
I assumed it would be like glucose or fructose?
I will likely switch over to maltose just for the clarity like Rick and Peter, or to Maltodextrose, like you and others.
Is there much difference between those two?

Does the agave on the right look too turbid, or OK for a sugar?
It seems to me my samples should all be a bit darker, for being 20ppm.

Other than that I would call my first batch a success!
Thanks.

-Sancho


Offline RickinWI

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Re: First run today
« Reply #21 on: June 27, 2015, 04:01:46 AM »
I second that. Put the agave back in the pantry where it belongs & head to the nearest grocery store & get a bottle of Karo light Corn syrup. While you're there you can get a little box of Knox unflavored gelatin for capping  ;)
Use Karo for at least your first 10 batches so you can get used to what looks normal. After that you can switch to other reducers if you want to experiment. Maltose would be the next to try. It is VERY different from maltodextrin.

Any time you add more drops of a reducer & it gets darker that means you did not have it fully reduced to begin with so keep good notes. There is no magic number of drops for cinnamon extract since yours will be different than mine. It sometimes takes overnight for something to fully reduce (depending on many factors).

Since you make larger batches you may want to considder switching your anode over to your Silver Eagle (if you have it suspended from a .999 silver wire). You could then up your mA to 15 ish. The black oxidation would then be less concentrated & you could do a batch quicker.
So many VARIABLES & so little TIME.

SanchoPanza

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Re: First run today
« Reply #22 on: June 27, 2015, 05:23:09 AM »
I will try a batch with the eagle.
I hear you about getting a few under my belt, so i won't be capping for a while yet.
With some of you having such great results with maltose and maltodextrin, why should even I mess around with karo?
Even Cinnamon appears to produce less turbidity than Karo, as many have posted here.
Is maltose to much for a beginner?
Maltodextrin?

-Sancho

Offline RickinWI

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Re: First run today
« Reply #23 on: June 27, 2015, 06:56:58 AM »
I see no reason to use maltodextrin as a reducer.

If, after reducing at least 5 or 10 batches with Karo, you want to try maltose then that's fine but be forewarned that if you do the reduction @ 80*F it will take a long time to finish reducing (a few hours). Gene would hate that  ;)

You can hasten the process by getting it hotter for reducing it with maltose. Then, as long as it's hot already, you might as well Gel-cap it right away too  ;)
So many VARIABLES & so little TIME.

Offline kephra

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Re: First run today
« Reply #24 on: June 27, 2015, 11:33:28 AM »
The difference between corn syrup, maltodextrin, maltose, and other simple sugars is the size of the molecule.  They all have one reducing site, and the primary difference is the weight required to fully reduce the silver.  If there is any difference in the results for 20 ppm colloidal silver, it is in the amounts used.  The amount in excess determines how fast the reduction occurs which effects how fast the nanoparticles build up.  What you should be experimenting with is the amount used.  EG: Changing the dilution of the Karo, etc.
There is the unknown and the unknowable.  It's a wise man who knows the difference.

SanchoPanza

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Re: First run today
« Reply #25 on: June 27, 2015, 03:07:10 PM »
Thanks Rick.
I have no problem waiting for it to reduce.
Maybe it's the slower reduction that gives such (clear) results?
Many have said here, that slower = clearer.

And yes, If maltose needs to be near boiling I might as well cap it then too.   :)
But, first things first.


-Sancho


SanchoPanza

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Re: First run today
« Reply #26 on: June 27, 2015, 03:21:28 PM »
If I'm understanding correctly, all the sugar types perform the same reducing action,
and the size or shape of the reduction molecule doesn't make any difference in the reduced Colloidal Silver?  Is that correct?

And, that the speed of reduction is controlled more by the concentration, rather than just the sugar type?

And, that clarity is at least partially affected by the speed of reduction?

I would extrapolate from that, that maltose-like clarity CAN be achieved with the proper concentration of a different reducer?

You don't have to convince me on the agave nectar, In my mind, it belongs in the pantry next to the Karo.   ;)

Thanks,
-Sancho

Offline kephra

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Re: First run today
« Reply #27 on: June 27, 2015, 03:34:29 PM »
If I'm understanding correctly, all the sugar types perform the same reducing action,
and the size or shape of the reduction molecule doesn't make any difference in the reduced Colloidal Silver?  Is that correct?
Yes, they all work by oxidizing the aldehyde group on the end of the molecule.  (for one thing to be reduced, another must be oxidized).  The sugar is destroyed in the process changing into a sugar alcohol like xylitol and releasing carbon dioxide gas.  You have probably seen the tiny bubble of carbon dioxide on the side of the jar as the silver reduces.

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And, that the speed of reduction is controlled more by the concentration, rather than just the sugar type?
Concentration and temperature.  More sugar or higher temperature make it go faster.

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And, that clarity is at least partially affected by the speed of reduction?
Yes, it seems so.

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I would extrapolate from that, that maltose-like clarity CAN be achieved with the proper concentration of a different reducer?
I get perfect clarity every time with Karo corn syrup.  Nothing else has done better.  I make my colloidal silver at room temp, with 1 ml of 1 M sodium carbonate per liter, then add 4 drops of 50% Karo and heat 1 liter for 2 minutes in my microwave which makes it warm but nowhere near boiling.  In 15 to 30 minutes then it is fully reduced and perfectly clear.  I filter it through a coffee filter to remove dust and dog hairs that always seem to be floating around. 

You don't have to convince me on the agave nectar, In my mind, it belongs in the pantry next to the Karo.   ;)

Thanks,
-Sancho
[/quote]
As for adding gelatin, the only problem with that is that no one knows if that affects its effectiveness in vivo.  The intestinal tract contains more bacteria than there are cells in the body, so thats a lot of targets for the silver particles.  I think it does, but there is no proof of that.
There is the unknown and the unknowable.  It's a wise man who knows the difference.

SanchoPanza

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Re: First run today
« Reply #28 on: June 27, 2015, 04:07:37 PM »



I get perfect clarity every time with Karo corn syrup.  Nothing else has done better.  I make my colloidal silver at room temp, with 1 ml of 1 M sodium carbonate per liter, then add 4 drops of 50% Karo and heat 1 liter for 2 minutes in my microwave which makes it warm but nowhere near boiling.  In 15 to 30 minutes then it is fully reduced and perfectly clear.  I filter it through a coffee filter to remove dust and dog hairs that always seem to be floating around. 

I'm looking for clarity, now that you said that, I have one foot out the door, to go get some Karo.
(The other foot is still very reluctant to put salt and vanilla in my Wheaties.)
(My third foot is just kicking me in my own ass, because we still don't have a "banging-head-on-wall" smiley).   ;)
Furthermore, it feels like Rick is pushing me out the door, just to steer me away from his secret Maltose weapon.

Quote
As for adding gelatin, the only problem with that is that no one knows if that affects its effectiveness in vivo.  The intestinal tract contains more bacteria than there are cells in the body, so thats a lot of targets for the silver particles.  I think it does, but there is no proof of that.


Not much proof for any of it,... but I'll play along until I reach a conclusion, or I get bored.  (insert yawning smiley here).
Still fun so far...
Thanks.

-Sancho

Offline kephra

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Re: First run today
« Reply #29 on: June 27, 2015, 04:18:36 PM »
Quote
(The other foot is still very reluctant to put salt and vanilla in my Wheaties.)
The vanilla is chemically inert here, and the amount of salt in a liter of colloidal silver will be .1 mg per liter, which is miniscule.  The salt is a byproduct of adjusting the pH of the product with sodium hydroxide.
There is the unknown and the unknowable.  It's a wise man who knows the difference.